Date: 8/16/25 10:24 am From: Robert O'Brien via Tweeters <tweeters...> Subject: Re: [Tweeters] Himalayan Blackberries
Fortunately, we have those as well. That is why I restricted my comments
to non-trees and pollinators in the wider sense. Not all insects are
pollinators, of course. But the so common notion among the general public
that pollinators = (bees (so often just Honey Bees) and butterflies).is
much too limiting.
And, by the way, Himalayan (& Evergreen) Blackberries are great for
Honeybees and are a seasonal staple for apiarists.
As for Bitter Cherries, they are native of course. And attractive to
wildlife in flower and in fruit. Thrushes love them.. But in our area
around Portland the invasive Eurasian Cherry, Prunus avium, is rampant.
This tree becomes gigantic and supplies huge crops per tree of the same two
features for birds and insects. And then, also around Portland, there is
the English Hawthorn. Ditto to the Eurasian Cherry. Rampant. We also
have the native Douglas (Black) Hawthorne on our place but the English
Hawthorn outperforms the native 10:1. in flower and fruit and rampacity
(is that even a word?).
Now I'm NOT saying we should let non-natives take over. Not at all. Just
trying to add a little realism to the invasion by the non-natives. Which
of course was the spirit of this entire thread. Which I greatly enjoy.
Bob OBrien Portland
On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 10:34 PM Steve Hampton via Tweeters <
<tweeters...> wrote:
> Good point on the insects, but let's add that native trees are critical.
> Chickadees and others need over 6,000 moth caterpillars to fledge a nest of
> chicks, and they only get those from native willows, alders, bitter
> cherries, etc.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 8:03 PM Robert O'Brien <baro...> wrote:
>
>> The very same concept applies to insects. I live on a large rural
>> property with mostly invasive annuals, biennials, perennials, etc.. Three
>> plants provide sustenance for many dozens of insect pollinators (*NOT*
>> just bees and butterflies) Queen Anne's Lace (native to Europe and Asia and
>> naturalized in North America and Australia ), and the two invasive
>> Thistle species. Without them, there would be virtually no insects here.
>> And birds need insects.
>> Here are a few examples for Queen Anne's Lace (~Wild Carrot).
>>
>> https://bugguide.net/adv_search/bgsearch.php?user=128549&taxon=&description=queen+ann&county=&city_location=&adult=&immature=&male=&female=&representative= >> Bob OBrien Portland
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 11:59 AM Steve Hampton via Tweeters <
>> <tweeters...> wrote:
>>
>>> Here's one of those strange examples: In California, Himalayan
>>> blackberries are one of the few places where seriously-declining Tricolored
>>> Blackbirds can nest successfully, as more native places (marshes) are now a
>>> patchwork easily infiltrated by predators such as night-herons and
>>> raccoons. I recall a rookery of 2,000 night-herons in a eucalyptus grove
>>> near a smallish cattail marsh. The herons wiped out 5,000 TRBL nests in a
>>> few nights. But in the blackberries, the Trikes are successful.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 9:05 AM HAL MICHAEL via Tweeters <
>>> <tweeters...> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Gary brings up a good point about some of our decisions about habitat,
>>>> its restoration, and modifications.
>>>>
>>>> Early in my career I read an article by a WDG Wildlife Biologist. He
>>>> described a situation (probably made up) of a corner of his yard overrun
>>>> with blackberries. A song Sparrow nested there. In honor of his European
>>>> roots, he annually "collected" a bird or two to eat. Every year the
>>>> sparrows nested and produced young. Then, he decided to clean up the yard,
>>>> install a gazebo and fire pit, and make the yard neater. No more sparrow
>>>> nesting, no more sparrow eating. He had converted a piece of land from
>>>> supporting Song Sparrow to essentially reducing the world population by a
>>>> pair and their young. Like putting up those barriers instead of
>>>> blackberry.
>>>>
>>>> The second was in conversations with an entomologist regarding
>>>> proposals to replace (exotic) stands of eucalyptus in coastal CA with
>>>> native shrubs and such. This would remove the trees in which Monarchs
>>>> wintered and not replace them (Monarchs have site fidelity) for decades at
>>>> the minimum.
>>>>
>>>> There are times when exotic species may be providing ecological
>>>> services that the native plants don't/didn't. Not saying that we should
>>>> keep all the exotics but perhaps a deeper dive into the services they
>>>> provide and how the loss of them will be mitigated.
>>>>
>>>> Hal Michael
>>>> Board of Directors, Ecologists Without Borders <http://ecowb.org/> >>>> Olympia WA
>>>> 360-459-4005
>>>> 360-791-7702 (C)
>>>> <ucd880...>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 08/15/2025 5:48 AM PDT Gary Bletsch via Tweeters <
>>>> <tweeters...> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear Tweeters,
>>>>
>>>> Although I favor native plants in a passive sort of way, I will never
>>>> bad-mouth the Himalayan Blackberry--if that is still the right name. I owe
>>>> my life to Himalayan Blackberries.
>>>>
>>>> In December of 1990, my 1971 Dodge Dart started sliding and spinning,
>>>> doing 360's all over Interstate 5 in Tukwila. I'd hit black ice. After
>>>> bouncing off a little subcompact, the car went careening toward a semi,
>>>> which I somehow missed. I distinctly remember saying goodbye to what had
>>>> seemed like a pretty darned good life up to that point. A moment later, I
>>>> was sitting in the driver's seat, utterly unharmed. The bulb of a huge
>>>> freeway light pole was slowly swinging back and forth right, a cubit from
>>>> my window. I had clipped the pole, which landed on my roof, denting it only
>>>> slightly. The front of the car had plunged into a huge patch of
>>>> blackberries, which absorbed the impact of a 3000-pound Mopar going 60 mph.
>>>> The frame was not bent; I just needed a new radiator and a few dents
>>>> hammered out.
>>>>
>>>> Today there is a line of concrete barriers where that blackberry patch
>>>> used to be. If I had hit that, I would almost certainly have died, or at
>>>> least suffered serious injury.
>>>>
>>>> At my old place in the Skagit Valley, we had huge, long thickets of
>>>> blackberries. The goats and I had our work cut out for us, keeping it under
>>>> control.
>>>>
>>>> White-crowned Sparrows and several other species nested in there. I
>>>> don't remember exactly what birds ate the fruits, but many did, certainly
>>>> including Starlings, Towhees, and Robins. In winter, I'd have all sorts of
>>>> interesting birds sheltering in those thickets, including White-throated
>>>> Sparrows almost every winter.
>>>>
>>>> Besides being my goats' absolute favorite food, the blackberries
>>>> provided an enormous bounty of fruit, and blackberry pie was a major
>>>> feature of our late-summer diet every year.
>>>>
>>>> Yours truly,
>>>>
>>>> Gary Bletsch
>>>>
>>>> PS I did a birding trip in the foothills of the Himalayas a few years
>>>> ago, visiting India and Bhutan. While I saw *Cannabis sativa *growing
>>>> wild all over the place, I never saw a blackberry. Maybe "Armenian
>>>> Blackberry" would be a better name. The *Wikipedia *article states
>>>> that the plant is native to Armenia and northern Iran.
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Steve Hampton
>>> Port Townsend, WA (qatáy)
>>>
>>>
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>>
>
> --
> Steve Hampton
> Port Townsend, WA (qatáy)
>
>
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